Plagarism In Comedy

[unfrufru]

from chortle. i've been following this for about a week and find it quite interesting.

A Star fool

Comic's U-turn over gag theft claims

Scottish-based stand-up Mac Star has been left with egg on his face after accusing Dara O’Briain of stealing his material on Have I Got News For You?

A week after making the claims, Star has been forced to admit that he WASN’T the first to write the joke he accused O’Briain of pilfering.

Star had threatened legal action over the gag, which imagined Hitler and Churchill playing rock, scissors, paper – with Churchill’s V-sign, representing scissors, defeating Hitler’s Nazi salute (paper) every time.

He threatened legal action, saying he had been using the joke for more than two years, and demanding “an apology and some form of compensation for the blatant disregard of performers’ rights” from O’Briain’s agents Off The Kerb, even though the presenter’s script is created by a team of writers.

O’Briain, right, hit back at the claims of gag theft, saying that it is inevitable that more than one comic can originate the same joke independently. "It's bad luck for him, and a shame he's lost a very good joke,” he said. “But this sort of thing is going to happen, and he shouldn't be slinging accusations of plagiarism around.”

However, Tasmanian-born Star was insistent that he was a victim of a concerted effort by English-based writers traveling to Scotland to pinch jokes. “It seems writers are coming north of the border to watch comedy and if they like the material, they think ‘well no one knows this guy down south" and just lift it,” he said.

But since details of Star’s actions were published on Chortle, users of the site’s forum have unearthed more examples of similar jokes being written independently. Other sightings of the same idea include:

• On a Beatles Internet newsgroup in 1996
• In the set of Brighton-based comic Stephen Grant, who used it in his Edinburgh show last year
• In a humour magazine called Mustard
• On Chris Morris’s Radio 1 show about 12 years ago in a sketch parodying wartime news reports.

Now Star has written an apologetic e-mail to Off The Kerb admitting his mistake.

“Due to further events of the Hitler paper rock scissors gag and evidence published on the forums of Chortle.co.uk. I feel I need to make a formal appology [sic] to all parties involved,” he wrote.

“Although I first thought of the gag a few years ago, it would seem that it has been in use for some time in various guises.”

“A larger slice of humble pie will no doubt be heading my way and I will relish every last bite of it.”

Star also acknowledges that he could be hoist by his own petard – that the first person to have come up with the gag could make the same claims against him as he made against O’Briain.

“I do now need to find out the people who wrote the original joke and say sorry for laying claim to it,” he admitted.

[Edward]

Hmm, World War Two ended about 60 years ago, and Rock, Paper, Scissors has existed far longer than that, yet Mac Star was certain not only that in those 60 years no-one before him could possibly have made the link between the game and the distinctive hand gestures of the two opposing leaders, but that the appearance of the joke in someone else's set is evidence of some kind of English conspiracy to steal Scottish jokes.

Riiiiight.

[Mythor]

Any time you make a joke about stuff that's "public" like that, it's a fair bet that someone else will manage to come up with the same joke.

Example: the new wireless controller for the Playstation 3 looks like a batarang/boomerang. So I joked to a friend that at least when you crack the shits at a game and throw the controller across the room, it'll just come right back to you!
Two days later, I read the same joke being told by Fargo at Gamespy.

A lot of jokes like that are fairly obvious, so I think you need to be careful about going apeshit if someone appears to have "stolen" it.
Dara may actually have heard Mac tell the joke, or one of the HIGNFY writers might've, etc... But there's no way to know. They may not even remember themselves that the joke came from a comic.

[Renee_Turner]

I think the general rule is that the more famous comedian gets the credit for the joke...I know this happened to someone I spoke to at Comfest, he found himself doing the same jokes as someone (I think Adam Hills) about 'fun' size chocolate. Because he was less well-known, people assumed he'd stolen it.

That being said, it's not hard to accidentally appropriate other people's stuff. I nearly stole a Matt King joke because I didn't realise that I'd remembered it, not created it. Fortunately my friend picked it up before I committed comedy theft.

[Alisso]

Originally Posted by Renee_Turner

I know this happened to someone I spoke to at Comfest, he found himself doing the same jokes as someone (I think Adam Hills) about 'fun' size chocolate. Because he was less well-known, people assumed he'd stolen it.

Nah, Tom Gleeson *G*

[Nick]

NERD!


(This part is so that I dont have a too short of fucking message... If i dont have ten characters I dont need them! BASTERED!)

[dermo]

There are so many comedians and only so many subjects, the likelyhood of more than one comic coming up with an idea is highly likely. The only time a less known comedian could be accused of stealing material would be if they lifted a comedians signiture set. For example, Ed byrn's Alanis Morrisett bit or Mike Wilmot's drunk spastic bastard bit.

I hope this makes sense...I'm rather ill at the moment with legionnairs disease and this could just be the drugs talking.

[VAxwell]

Damnit Nicko! You not only stole my point about Ed Byrn, Mike Wilmot and their unfortunate experience with Alanis Morrisett and a spastic bastard, but you stole my disease as well...

I'm taking you AND your arse to court.

[dermo]

Bring it on! I've got a team of lawyers and a big pile of drugs, not to mention a tank of oxygen. I'm ready for you *cough, cough, wheeeeze

[Renee_Turner]

Nicko, Did you go to the Melbourne Aquarium while you were here?

[Ben]

Fun sized Mars bars were a staple of Ben Elton's comedy set (Motor Mouth? Motorvation?) of the mid 1980s. Just a sign of the times in this increasingly resource conscious world. Reduce, reuse, recycle.

[dermo]

Yup, I went to the aquarium, but i went with lots of others. I know all about it's problems but I didn't get it from there. Even if I did, it was worth it, sure, i may have real trouble breathing at the moment, but I got to ride on a big ice cube and see a baby shark.

[Renee_Turner]

You rode on an ice cube? This may be just becasue I was too poor to go to the aquarium, but that sounds a bit weird to me.

[Spawn of Satan]

Originally Posted by dermo

I got to ride on a big ice cube

Damn, I should have gone.